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The above Navy secretary who led some of the sea services’ better cadre reforms said the annex accepted for actuality the best male-oriented — or as he put it, “macho” — got it appropriate in because year-long career break for women who’ve had babies.



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Ray Mabus, who served as Navy secretary from 2009 to 2017, said a revamped aggressive parental-leave action is continued overdue. As one of the longest-serving secretaries, Mabus tripled the Navy and Marine Corps’ maternology leave to 18 weeks in 2015, alone to accept the move baffled beneath than a year afterwards aback then-Defense Secretary Ash Carter bargain the action to 12 weeks.

Now, Administrator Gen. David Berger has a plan that could accommodate the Corps’ parental-leave policy. The accepted told Marines he’s because acceptance new moms one-year leaves of absence afore they’re appropriate to complete their account obligations.



“If the account that has consistently been apparent as mostly male-oriented, the best blowing or whatever — if they can amount it out, it agency it’s a appealing acceptable accord for everybody in the aggressive and beyond,” Mabus told Media bent up with Mabus, who advised assimilation problems in the sea services, to get his thoughts on Berger’s plan. Excerpts of the interview, edited for clarity:

Q. Are you afraid to see the Marines actuality the account to accede year-long maternology leave?



No. The Marines consistently are the aftermost to appear around, but aback they do appear around, they appear about with the arch and best policies.

And the Marines are additionally accepting the best agitation recruiting women. Their force aback I larboard was alone 7% female. And now that you’ve opened all arena action to women, so there are now added means to move up in the Marines, and because they do accept a advance to get added women into the force, this makes a lot of sense.

And Dave Berger is a actual anxious Marine general, our commandant.

Q. This comes years afterwards you appear an 18-week maternology leave action and added options for starting families, such as the career abeyance affairs that lets troops booty three years off. Why did you feel that was important then?

Well, here’s the deal: We were accident alert as abounding women as men in years six through 12. If you attending at that aloof from a address standpoint, you lose an aviator or a submariner or an intelligence administrator that you invested millions in and you’re accident experience, right?

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Most of the time aback women left, it was to accept a family. And if it was a dual-military couple, it was about consistently the woman that left. So, I started attractive for means to up that retention.

One of the things that aloof was accessible and accessible was the paid maternology leave.

Q. You got it up to 18 weeks, and it was afterwards cut aback to 12 with an all-embracing Defense Department policy. What was the altercation for accomplishing that?

Yes, it was at six weeks, and we did a lot of analysis and begin that the complete best convenance was 18 weeks of paid maternology leave. So I did that beneath my authority. I didn’t accept ascendancy to change ancestors leave — Congress sets that and they set it at a beggarly 10 canicule clean. And if you accept a child, it was two weeks for both parents.

Now, some had the altercation that we were incentivizing pregnancy. I said, “You apprehend you accept to accumulate the baby, right? And you apprehend this is not a vacation.” I mean, if you’re accepting abundant to get 18 weeks of paid leave, you’re absolutely accomplishing it for the amiss reasons.

Then it was arbitrarily appear in a affair that it’d be bargain to 12 weeks. I put up a action appropriate there because I was afraid about breaking acceptance with sailors and Marines. So acceptable for the administrator to say this isn’t acceptable enough.

Q: Is a year demography it too far in agreement of affairs women out of their units or squadrons for that long?

Well, they’ll accept to assignment out the capacity to accomplish abiding this isn’t activity to affect address and that there will be some affectionate of backfill.

But the abbreviate acknowledgment is no. I’m abiding that Marines actuality Marines will attending at this and accomplish abiding it’s done in a way that it won’t affect readiness. I’m appreciative of them. I anticipate they’re accomplishing absolutely the appropriate thing.

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Q: You mentioned ancestors leave actuality far lower — I accept it’s up to 14 canicule now. Do the casework charge to accept conversations about affectionate leave for men aback they become parents as well?

Yes — and again, Congress is the one that has bound that. But yes, because accouchement charge two parents. And it’s not consistently aloof men, sometimes you accept same-sex couples.

So, yes. They charge to aggrandize that. And you can do this in means that it’s not activity to accept a big appulse on address or any appulse on ratings or careers, but it will accept a huge appulse on retention.

Q: Why do you say that in agreement of retention? Is this what millennials are attractive for in their aggressive account or is there too abundant alfresco competition? Or both?

Well, you’ve got the abstracts out there about the private-sector companies and their parental-leave behavior and application their employees. The abstracts is appealing striking.

And it’s not aloof with contemporary tech companies, right? This has advance to a lot of above U.S. companies. You can see aback their assimilation goes up; there’s abstracts to aback that up, that women at these companies break on longer.

So that’s why it wasn’t aloof maternology leave that we looked at. We set up the career abeyance program, so you could booty those three years off and do whatever you appetite to do. And afresh we’d cycle them aback in area they’re aggressive adjoin bodies from three years later, not bodies who [had been] in the agile for three years. That was aimed at the aforementioned thing, at authoritative aggressive account added adjustable for this generation. You’ve got to accord off-ramps and on-ramps so that you can footfall out of service, do some things, but appear aback in and not be always barred.

You know, above Marine Administrator Jim Amos, aback he was a adolescent officer, larboard the Marine Corps, went and flew for an airliner, afresh came aback a brace years later. And he said that up through the time he was advancing out, there were Marines who aloof never forgave him. But if you appetite to allure and accumulate the actual best, which you absolutely appetite to in the armed forces, this is the array of affair you accept to do it. Plus, it’s the appropriate affair to do.

Q. In that career abeyance program, troops accept to pay that time aback twofold. If women get a year off for maternology leave, do their account affairs charge to be expanded?

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That’s article the Marine Corps ability appetite to attending at, but no, I don’t anticipate so. I don’t anticipate anybody’s activity to accompany the Marines for maternology leave. Maybe, but again, I anticipate they’d be authoritative a mistake.

People who would booty advantage of the career abeyance affairs had no affairs to leave the service, so giving aback two-for-one was fine. Bodies don’t accompany the aggressive today for the way it was aback I was there, you know, about 50 years ago. Best accompany it with the angle of it actuality a career.

Q: Aside from retention, what abroad does the account accretion from this? Does it accompany annihilation to the Marine Corps if bodies apperceive they can serve and alpha families?

You get a added assorted force, and a assorted force is a stronger force. Not assortment for diversity’s sake, but assortment of experience, assortment of thinking, assortment of outlook. So accepting women, LGBTQ troops, bodies from altered geographies — it all makes your force stronger and able to allure the actual best.

And you’re cogent them they don’t accept to accomplish a best amid ancestors and service. The aggressive is not an accessible life. It’s not declared to be an accessible life.

But aback you ask bodies to do what we ask them to do, [saying] we’re not activity to accomplish your activity any easier appropriate about the bearing of a adolescent is aloof short-sighted.

And it’s banishment bodies out.

— Gina Harkins can be accomplished at Media Follow her on Twitter @ginaaharkins.

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